Marina’s Message to Clement
This concludes Marina’s Round 1 with sketch R1/A.
The first Mod (trial, version) of my Holy Grail has arrived! Below is my reaction / message to Clement:
Dear Clement,
I am so very excited to receive my first “Mod”! Thank you so much once again for agreeing to make my very own Holy Grail. I have never had a perfume done especially for me before and I find it difficult to review something that was so kindly created for me and even harder to actually criticize. It feels awkward to say the least.
I want to start by saying that I think my first Mod, “Holy Grail R1/A” is a very pretty scent. It smells feminine and light, almost ethereal. I also smell a lot of almond here. Perhaps my nose is playing tricks on me and there is no almond there? It is not one of my favorite notes and, unless it is crucial for the composition, I would prefer not to include it. If I had to describe how the scent smells right now, I would say it smells of almond, light vanilla and a little bit of musk. It reminds me of scents like Castelbajac, Lea St Barth and Strenesse. In my opinion, these are light, somewhat fresh, “cool” scents. I would like my fragrance to be quite a bit heavier, more “substantial”, much “warmer”, much spicier and much “darker” than it is now. I wonder if what I am saying actually makes any sense and I apologize if it doesn’t.
To sum it up, I would like the scent to become heavier and spicier. More sultry, more sensual. I would like the musk note to be less transparent than it is now, in fact I would love for it to become “dirtier”, more animalic. A more pronounced cardamom note would also make me very happy as would an addition of a warmer, more robust woody note and some amber.
I would love to hear from you regarding the scent, the first Mod and my ramblings about them.
Bestest of wishes,
Marina.
Please tune in next week for Clement’s response to my review of the first Mod.
33 Comments
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Marina
Katie,
That’s eaxctly what I want, satisfied deep-throated growl of a content animal tucked inside my scent 🙂Cardamom…how can I describe the appeal. In my mind, there are two “kinds” of spices, “dry” and …well, “moist” (heh). And example of dry would be pepper (of any color). Cardamom falls into the “juicy spice” category. It has certain richness and depth, and its spiciness has a sweet undertone to it…and that juicy-spicy-sweetness is what I like. I know this sounds like ramblings of a mad woman 🙂
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mike storer
There are hundreds of trained perfumers watching this board. I’m very disappointed that Clement isn’t sharing his formula with us and how he is going about it. I mistakenly thought that that was what this was all about. It could be such a great opportunity to learn and also how to employ IFF’s products. It could be a great push for his company.
Marina, could you get word to him that hundreds of us would like technical details of what ingredients he is using and why? Which accord he started with, etc. Which musk he chose, for example. Many of us are versed in the names of the items, IFF or otherwise. Or can you share his e-mail address with us and I’ll ask him directly?
Thank you, Mike Storer, perfumer in Los Angeles.
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perfumecritic
I second that desire to know what the perfumers are employing int heir compositions.
Ok – onto the sniffing: Marina, I love this scent. I agree that it is a light, pretty, clean scent and it immediately reminded me of Lolita minus the licorice. It’s a pretty composition that reveals some nice floral tones as it develops.
If this is merely the starting point, I can’t wait to see where it goes!
Marlen
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lilybp
My first (impressionistic) reaction to this scent more or less mirrors Marina’s. I think this is a lovely fragrance, really lovely–and it gets lovelier as it goes along. For a light scent, it has remarkable tenacity. That said, I should also say that I don’t think it’s remarkable (yet). It reminds me strongly of something else, but I can’t remember what, perhaps because although I enjoy scents like this one, I don’t wear them much. I don’t think I would buy this, but if I had it, I would happily wear it in the summer. I can understand Marina’s desire for something more spicy and animalic–I would like more of those qualities myself. But I think this would be a hit with many people! P.S. My husband thought it was really nice.
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Sali
Greetings to all. I received the samples today–thank you very much for involving me in this project and for the link to my blog on your blogroll. Marina and I are basically “evil scent twins” so naturally I like Holy Grail R1/A very much. I tend to prefer cool scents over warm scents overall (or rather, what others describe as cool are usually warm enough for me). I think it’s a rather gorgeous blend and I’m happy to wear it so thanks again.
I agree it smells like Castelbajac a bit–it also reminds me of Amor Amor and Ghost–but I think this one’s better.
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Marina
Dear Mike,
Thank you very much for your comment and for your interest in our project. It is extremely flattering to think that so many perfumers might be reading. Having said that, I have a feeling that the people who might be looking for very detailed, very specialist information, might be disapponted. We are hoping that the blog will reflect the process of perfume creation, however I don’t believe the perfumers would feel comfortable sharing their formulas. We are hoping to open the door to this mysterious world, but some things will probably remain secret.
Sincerely,
Marina -
Marina
Marlen,
I am glad you liked it! I am trying to imagine Lolita without licorice and failing, for me Lolita IS licorice! 🙂 -
Marina
Judith,
Our impressions are definitely similar, apart from tenacity. This is something I forgot to mention in my little review there. The scent was very light on me and did not last long. On a blotter, it was gone in an hour. On my skin, it lasted no more than half an hour. Strange that we differ so much in this respect. -
Marina
Dear Sali,
Well, naturally you like it more than I do…no, but wait, how can we be evil twins when we share so many favorites? Orchidee Blanche. Attrape-Coeur. Musc Ravageur (or am I mistaken about this one?)…and these are my most favorite of favorites. I know that in some respects our tastes differ, for example you are much more of a floral girl than I am, but in other areas we actually agree. Yes, we do! 🙂 -
Marchlion
Marina. Honey. My recollection of the ultimate point of this project is that Clement Gavarry would create your Holy Grail — not perfumery by blogger consensus, but YOUR Holy Grail, in a wonderful, possibly once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for you to work with a perfumer at this level. And the rest of us get to watch, which is fun. Now, on to my Bull-in-the-China-Shop point, which you can rebut at leisure — or even delete — if I’m wrong. I got your first sample today, and I smelled it, and I like it, it’s very nice. And this is the problem. I don’t know squat about how perfumes are built. But I read your blog, we swap samples, I know what you like, and twenty bucks says this isn’t remotely what you wanted. Let me climb further out on this limb and hand you a saw. If I am correct, if this is completely the wrong direction, you need to tell him so, because this is his job and his creation and he needs that information. You love some of the dirtiest fragrances I can think of — MKK, Borneo, Ambre Russe, Le Labo Vetiver, Musc Ravageur. When I read your initial brief, what I was picturing was a wearable MKK, as hilarious a concept as I find that… I think you maybe confused Mr. Gavarry with your tasteful references to Bois de Iles and Attrape-Coeur? I’ve re-read your initial brief and your (clearly disappointed but very apologetic and polite) follow up — your words: heavier, warmer, spicier, darker, dirtier, animalic, robust …. they leap out at me. I think you should send him a sample of Marina de Bourbon. Or construct a Marina Skank-o-Meter and tell him, okay, MKK is a 10 and I’m looking for something in the 7 – 8 range …. I cannot help but believe this first draft is a big step in the wrong direction. Where’s the musk? The rubber feet dipped in amber? Rasputin’s armpit? Am I completely off base here, or is he? I wonder.
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Marina
March,
I don’t know *what” you smelled in Marina de Bourbon that it scared you so…it’s not dirty *enough* for me, my dear! 🙂
Seriously though, there is an answer and an explanation of everything in your wonderful comment. When you say that my mention of the refined Bois des Iles and Attrape-Coeur might have given Clement a somewhat wrong impression of me and my tastes, I believe that you nail it, March! I think in this first version of the scent he was trying to spare my sensibilities and to go gently, because he doesn’t know (yet) what a “dirty” taste I have. See, for you “wearable MKK” is a contradiction in terms, but for me it IS wearable and enjoyable. Rasputin’s armpit, indeed! 🙂
I loved your suggestion of Marina’s Skank-o-Meter…I am looking for something with skanky-ness of no less than 8.
This is just the very, very first step yet, and this was only a “ghost”, a “hint” of what I like, but if the intesity and the “dirtyness” are taken up a couple of notches…Ka-ching! 🙂 -
kuri
Got the samples today! It was a lovely surprise to come home to from a tedious Japanese test.
I’ve just sprayed this on. So far it’s very pretty. I get some sweetness, maybe a tinge of musk? But not too much of either. I’d agree it’s on the lighter side. But this is fascinating. I’m not getting any almond or vanilla yet. Maybe the slightest hint that it will turn powdery. No, it’s smelling a bit sweeter now. Definitely on the sweet side. Not sillage to speak of yet; I have to get really close to my skin to smell it.
Really pretty. It’s leaning towards fruity? Or maybe that is a faint whiff of vanilla. Will have to see.
Anyway, doesn’t smell anything like what I imagine dark, animalic scents smell like!
Have to say, I’d think that technical details and such would be trade secrets and as such closely guarded.
By the way, saw a Marina de Bourbon fragrance called Mon Ange in the store today. Anyone know anything about it?
Another question; would you mind if I spritz this on my friends too? I want to see if anyone gets almond. I love almond.
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jenny
Hi Marina,
First of all I think it’s realy difficult for a perfumer to understand exactly what the client(in this case you) had in mind. I see the two perfumers has different ways to work on the perfume. The perfumer Laurent wrote to Katie first before he started with the first trial version, to be sure he understood her correctly, and asked her more details. When I read your proposal I had a dark ambery fragrance in mind with sweet spicy notes. Maybe it’s nice to tell you that the perfumers on my Yahoo group discuss about the fragrance and that we all trying to make our own version of it. We are a bit dissapointed that there is no information at all about the creating of the fragrance, I understand that Clement doesn’t give away his formula but he could tell something about his way of creation. For example we love to know what kind of material he would use for the Saffron note, the one we know is restricted by IFRA and can only be used in a real small amount.
I would love to buy the first trial version, but I can’t find out how. -
Marina
Clare,
Of course, spritz it on your friends and then let us know what they think!! It is entirely possible that I am the only person in the world who gets almond from this scent. But I swear, it is there. On me the mod was the truest bitter almond scent I have ever tried. 🙂
I have not tried Mon Ange, never even heard of it, I am going to try to find it online. I am a big fan of the original M de B scent. -
Marina
Jenny,
I had no idea you and your colleagues on the Yahoo group were making the version. That is very exciting!
You are absolutely right when you say the two perfumers have very different styles. I think there will be much more communication and information coming from Laurent than from Clement. But that is how they work, how they are, we can’t force them, otherwise it won’t be natural. My hope is that, as time goes on, the perfumers will become more used to the project, will get in the rythm (just like all of us) and will be more comfortable sharing their thoughts and *some* information.
As for saffron, I am curious too and next time I have a chance to write a message to Clement I will be sure to ask. -
Sali
Marina, maybe we’re just “evil scent cousins”, not twins. We do agree on some fragrances, although Attrape-Coeur and Musc Ravageur, both of which I adore, aren’t what I’d consider everyday scents and I find them hard to wear. I love them for that reason, too, and find myself craving them at times. They’re just very heavy, so I think you need lots more depth than what R1/A offers to even get close to that realm.
As for Orchidee Blanche, I prefer L’Instant which to me is a modernized version of it, with notes such as magnolia and honey. Btw, I smell honey in R1/A now and I think it’s all the honey I can take. I don’t know if it’s an actual note in it ut I instantly thought of Orchidee Blanche. Well, good luck! I hope your HG turns out perfectly. I envision your HG as being intensely animalic but also soft and warm, rather classical in style.
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Marina
Sali,
“intensely animalic but also soft and warm, rather classical in style” is EXACTLY, and I mean EXACTLY what I imagine! You said it so well. Ah! -
Victoria's Own
I very much liked the sample, but then I prefer not to venture too far to the dark side. I smell something almond-like, maybe heliotrope to make it powdery. It didn’t seem to last very long on me either. After the inital spray it settled into a soft skin scent.
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Marina
Victoria,
Thank you very much for sharing your impressions. So I am not the only one getting almond/heliotrope. That’s good to know! -
Victoria
I had a chance to wear R 1/A for a couple of days and to test it on a blotter. R1/A is very gentle and feminine, with the sparkly sweet citrusy top slowly melting into the sweet lactonic softness accented with vanilla. It has a rather trendy gourmand sweetness to it, however it remains very soft, perhaps much softer than what I envision as Marina’s perfect fragrance. I find it very tenacious, but not very intense. When I read Marina’s brief, I immediately envisioned a floriental fragrance with spicy and ambery facets, perhaps slightly classical in the composition. Of course, having followed Marina’s blog for about a year, I speak with an advantage of hindsight.
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Marina
V,
Thank you very much for you review! A “floriental fragrance with spicy and ambery facets, perhaps slightly classical in the composition” is just what I want!
I don’t really want a very heady/heavy scent, but, like you, I found the first mod to be very/too soft (and fleeting, on my skin). -
aromascope
My impression of Holy Grail Round 1 is not the greatest. On my skin, it’s sweet and slightly soapy fruity musk. It lacks density. To my nose it just smells like a typical department store fragrance. Knowing Marina (who’s my scent twin), she wouldn’t call it her holy grail. Thanks!
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Marina
Ina,
Thank you very much for the review! The lack of density was main issue too. When it is made more substantial, spicier and a little more animalic, it will be great. -
Patty
I just got mine! I like this first mod too, though it doesn’t seem very Marina’ish to me either, but I’m not smelling any almond either? Odd.
Yes, to classify as Colombina the Terrible’s HG, it must be darker, dirtier and hiss just a little.
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moon_fish
So much fun to read the blogroll comments… Hope to smell it somehow in future!
Especially the last samples which will be close to what you want. When the idea will be clear and just the accents adding and facets needs to polish… -
Marina
Moon-Fish,
Thank you very much for your comment! I too hope you will be able to smell our scents (I sort of think that Katie’s scent might be more to your liking, but still…), because I would love to hear your opinion! -
Andy
Hurray, I got my sample….express mail. Thank you!
It is quite amazing how the same words on a piece of paper bring up totally different images when read by different persons. That is what I thought when I sniffed the first step towards the holy grail for Marina. Based on what I had under my nose on a little paper strip I tried to imagine what the perfumer behind the trial version had in mind, the images that he was building based on Marina’s description. The other way round, the same perfumer will be faced with feedback and impressions that any of his creations might bring up, comments by clients which again will try to write down their images with words that just can’t it all back. That’s – I guess – one of the challenges of the whole project. Marina’s and Katie’s perfumer will have to find their way into these personalities, visions…
Thus, I had a different image of the holy grail. Am I disappointed? Not at all. What I get is –on paper- a scent that is well structured and I must admit that it really is well done, very well done.
There are spices, definitely, but…is it what I imagine under cardamon? I get more of a pepper note, after an initial whiff of an exquisite citrus hint which sounds very much like a nice bergamot.
And then, the scent moves on, away from the initial spiciness towards a more (velvety? powdery? dry?) calm touch of what might be interpreted as saffron, remembering me in a line that is found within myrrh, but without any of the somewhat dark woody notes that go along with it. What is missing is this edible character of saffron, that I like so much.
Then comes the toughest part… the iris thing which I do not find convincing, yet. The composition takes a twist towards a line which reminds me of lilial stories, (smells somewhat cheap, doesn’t it?), somewhat sweet, showing promising signs of a guerlinade, but too nice and even the hints of animalic notes appearing from a rather pleasant back do not make this trial the “romantic, golden, candle-lit” perfume that I imagined and Marina asks for.
On my skin, I have to admit, it looks a little bit spicier than on paper but this impression is too short too call it a spicy perfume. The body, which is amazingly lasting on my skin, is nice, well done, and on my skin I get some musky ambergris lines that I love, but….please my dear perfumer fellow forgive me… …I just miss the beef! It is too nice. Time to test the limits!
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Marina
Dear Andy,
Thank you so much for you wonderful review!
When you mentioned myrrh, I actually jumped in my chair, because when I smelled the scent for the first time, that almondy-medicinal quality that it has made me think of that aspect myrrh. I must say I like myrrh as a note but not this almondy-medicinal quality of it (which is very evident in Lutens La Myrrhe, for example).
I also would like the saffron note to be made more substantional and, as you say, edible. The same applies to iris. Your very professional nose found the note there, although you thought it was not convincing yet. My untrained nose didn’t even detect iris in Mod 1 🙂
Thank yuo again for the review, Andy! It was fascinating to read, truly! -
kuri
What lovely reviews.
Cool, I will definitely be spritzing my friends with this! Maybe I just don’t know what bitter almond smells like 😀
I tried it on again today in much cooler weather. Today I get the “sparkly sweet citrusy top” that Victoria mentioned, and it’s a lively spicy citrus that I find very delicious, although it seems very sweet. I would have thought the sweetness would bother me, but it doesn’t at all. I suppose the spice balances it out. I think it reminds me of Hawaiian Punch, which I haven’t smelled in years.
(off topic: mon ange appears to be a release limited to Japan) -
Marina
C,
I am so glad you like it. I am also curious to see whether yuo will like the next version(s) as much. They hopefully will be less sparkly and more “on the dark side” 🙂
I am going to look for MOn Ange on ebay.
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Katie
Heh, you and the animals Marina! Sultry animals! Actually, dirty scents are such fun, and I hope your next mod will have a deep-throated growl tucked inside of it.
If I may ask, what is it about cardamom that you find so compelling? I know it might be too hard to articulate, but if you can would you mind sharing?