Hey Marina!
I fell from a chair like the chimp in this video below when I opened one of the two bottles of the last mods for your fragrance after receiving them from Clement back in November (or was it in October?).
I’m just exaggerating about the refreshingly stinky note in R4/M.
So, who would be wearing this? I smell a chic European woman in her mid thirties who lives in an opulent apartment in the 16th Arrondissement. She doesn’t like jeans. She likes Fendi fur coats. But she has a classic sense of style without being boring. Unfortunate for me, she is not my type of woman, and I am clearly not her type of guy.
Your Holy Grail is now ‘locking in’ to a particular style which has a great composition, and I’m just talking nonsense here. But if you allow me, in the end, I’d expect an ambivalent quality echoing contradictions in your Holy Grail. Here’s very chic*k Gemma Ward wearing Fendi as opposed to an elegant and mature woman (hmm, sounds good, though) in Paris 75016.
Or is this totally not what you want in your Holy Grail?
Nobi
N.F. Shioya
A sculptor living in New York
25 Comments
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Sacre Nobi
Marina, this is just an opinion – Shalimar is the scent of Parisian women. Women who wear Shalimar would appreciate your Holy Grail. Now, this definitely shouldn’t change I think. Mature or not is actually not the issue here. Gemma Ward in Fendi was just an easy way to show an ambivalent quality in European chic. I’m trying to think a different example… what are the things that contradicts classy European feeling that the scent has but wouldn’t spoil it… any ideas?
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Marina
More skank should successfully contradict the class π But not negate it. We want a balance of skank and class. There is ambivalence, right there.
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Victoria
I imagine Marina as Gemma Ward in that Fendi coat (albeit, my vision is blonder). π
Marina, would sweetness also contradict the class inherent in your idea (an overt sweetness rather than a honeyed rose and vanilla a la Shalimar)? I am very curious.
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Marina
Victoria, I am beyond flattered, and – I wish! π
I think sweetness definitely would contradict the “class”. And I do want some sweetness in the scent, but not an overwhelming amount. -
Sacre Nobi
Marina, I have a question. SKANK – does it simply denote a “bad” smell? Or are you talking about the attitude and style in the composition? I’m assuming that Clement will read this part soon and have the same question.
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Marina
Nobi,
I guess the attitude is inseparable from the “bad” smell. By “bad” I don’t mean anything as obviously disgusting as Etat Libre’s “revolutonary” (ahem) Secretions Magnefique. Dear god, no. Just a hint of muskiness, earthiness, leatheriness, indolic-ness. Have you smelled a vintage Dior, any of them, but let’s say vintage Diorella? (or any Roudnitska scent, really) It effortlessly combines supreme elegance with the “skanky” base. I don’t know what exactly constitutes skank there, but Roudnitska surely knew how to do it right π Skank, when done correctly, adds sexiness to the composition. It makes a scent smell a little “off” without making it smell bad. It prevents it from just being conventionally beautiful. It adds a “human” element to what otherwise would be a perfect but lifeless marble statue of a scent. You know? -
Sacre Nobi
I understand. So more skank may contradict the class in today’s context, but it sounds like going back to the old days. I personally don’t like fresh clean scents which are prevalent in the US market but always expect things to move forward, not backward. How do you think this would be done in your fragrance? I’m just curious, and you don’t need to pursue something new if that’s not your intention π But I should add that R4/M has a contemporary facet.
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Marina
Sometimes going backwards is going forward. There, my wisdom of the day π I don’t want any freshness in my scent at all. If freshness is associated with modernity, then to heck with modernity, give me a retro scent π I actually think that the “contemporary facet” will happen anyway. Clement strikes me as a very “now” perfumer, very forward, very contemporary, and that will be obvious in the scent. So the skank I want, combined with his contemporary touch, would create the ambivalence that we talked about. π
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March
Marina and Nobi — I can only speak for myself, but I use “skank” as a catch-all term on the blog for things that are indolic or animalic — things that smell dirty. You know I’m not a perfumer, but off the top of my head I’m thinking of the dirty indoles in, say, jasmine — or the dirty musks, say, SL MKK or Yatagan. Or, at the extreme end, the “cum accord” of Secretions Magnifique. However, Extreme Skank (like SM) seems like a party trick — it’s unwearable, in my opinion. I’m going to post this before I lose it and do another thought.
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March
Marina — FYI — I sent Nobi a sample of CB Musk and he was underwhelmed — it didn’t smell like real, proper musk to him (and CB actually said it was the “idea” of musk, to be fair.) But the larger, more interesting point to me was: so far as I know, Nobi didn’t find it dirty — it wasn’t a skanky smell to him, it didn’t smell animalic or indolic or sexy, you get the idea. So now I am wondering if there is some cultural and/or gender component to skank?
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March
Finally (and I hope these comments are going somewhere, because they’re not showing up here!) I think Nobi is exactly right. I *do* think skank is the perfect contradiction to “class” today, because we have such clean scents. But think of so many of the vintage fragrances we love — they have what I assume is civet, musk, ambergris, and/or castoreum in their base. Man, they smell dirty — a ripe, unwashed, sexual smell. To me, that ripe smell is both class and anti-class. I think it would be perfect in your Holy Grail, and very much you.
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Sacre Nobi
I like that, Marina! “Less is More” has become an overused idea, and I was looking for something new. I’ve almost forgotten that “going back is going forward” is a very Japanese approach to things in life.
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Marina
March, I agree with everything you say. So Nobi did not find CB Musk skanky, huh? Nobi, please try HUman Existence from Mugler Perfume Le Coffret, if you haven’t already, and/or Secretions Magnefique by Etat Libre d’Orange. Those two are extreme, exagerrated skanks, and not what I want, but it will exemplify what skank is π
I want just a nice dollop of skank to add “anti-class” to the “class”. Anything more and the scent becomes an unwearable art piece (Human Existence) or an infantile affectation (Etat Libre). -
Sacre Nobi
good lord! march, i found your comments with bunch of spams that had been caught by the wordpress plugin. maybe the plugin catches words like civet and indole π
cultura difference? maybe. “japanese chestnut flower” means “cum accordβ in japan. it’s the smell of early summer for us, but for chemist it’s the smell of spermine (C10H26N4) or spermidine (C7H19N3). i personally think it’s a peaceful scent. -
Sacre Nobi
marina, i have the worst collection of skanks created by the masters, and won’t be shocked by anything π
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Victoria
I also did not find CB Musk very musky. It rather smelled like fur hides. One of my uncles worked in Siberia and as a bonus for his difficult and dangerous work, he would receive sable hides. They would be tanned by the time he got them, and I still remember the smell. It was not unpleasant, but very distinctive. CB Musk smelled just like that.
I would be curious how Nobi finds Secretions Magnifique. Some people found it revolting, whereas it did not seem like that at all to me. It is very interesting, and I will always keep some on hand for reference. On the other hand, I cannot really wear it as perfume.
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March
V — I thought Secretions smelled like blood and breast milk. I found it frightening (I assume that’s the smell of blood ringing the alarms) but not sperm-y, which is how most people found it.
Personally, the one in the line that disgusted me most was Encens et Bubblegum. My God, that was appalling.
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Sacre Nobi
victoria, it’s an interesting story… and ‘siberia’ has a special meaning to many japanese as you can imagine.
i will try secretions magnifique π -
Victoria
March, I did not smell much of blood in it. Granted, blood is a very coppery smell, but the metallic tinge in SM was somewhat different. Nevertheless, I can completely see what you mean. All in all, for wearing I only liked Jasmin et Cigarette, Putain des Palaces and Nombril Immense.
Nobi, for the political prisoners of the Tsarist regime, it was Georgia and the Caucasus mountains that were the “Siberia” of the Soviet era. As for my uncle, he was working to cut down the forests. He even invented some type of saw that worked particularly well in the cold temperatures of Siberian forests. Another thing I remember him bringing from Siberia were the huge pinecones, with little edible nuts inside. They would leave my hands smelling of resinous sap for hours!
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Marina
SM was the most vile scent I have ever encountered. In a perfume or perhaps ever. Breast milk?? π It was the stench of a corpse eaten by fish in a dirty river.
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And turning to something much nicer… I’d love to taste some of those pine nuts again. π
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Marina
PS. Nobi, that “worst collection of skanks” created by the masters piqued my interest…I am envious!
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kuri
You know, I don’t find marina’s scent stinky anymore, although I did when I first smelled the mods. Hrm… perhaps y’all are influencing my nose? I had a friend sniff an incense from one of those companies that makes very expensive candles; she didn’t like it at all! I thought it was nice and interesting.
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Marina
HAHAHA
And I fell from a chair when I read this. I want an ambivalent quality too! I want Gemma Ward wearing Fendi! Let me get this straight, you feel that the mods smells…um, too mature? What other perfume(s) do you find possess this mature quality? I am just very curious. Oh and , please, send the stinky mod to me asap! π